I thought this would be a good place to get some thoughts on Ultra high performance tires from people that have used them. I currently have 225/45/16 P-Zeros. This is my first time using P-Zeros and thus far I love them. So you know I have -2.5 degrees negative camber on my front wheels. They handle excellent on the road and the wet traction is not excellent but good. The only driving on them so far is one autocross, I have a Road Atlanta driving school coming up in May though. So I have been testing them on "Backroads U", they have been handeling turns like a race tire. I have also been doing some testing with them on some familiar on-ramps, I had increased my speed by 15mph the first time on this one on-ramp since installing the P-Zeros. When I got the P-Zeros I almost got Dunlop SP-9000 instead. I also use Hoosier tires on my 15" wheels for racing. I have to say that Hoosier's are the best race tire, however they are not cheap, they don't last as long as other race tires and you do need lots of negative camber for Hoosier's.
On a related topic I was reading about "Smart tire", for $199 installed (they pay $80 to whoever installs it) you get four sensors that are mounted under your tire on each wheel. From a dash mounted display you can then view all four tire pressures and temperatures. You can also set min and max levels of pressure and receive warnings when they fall out of spec. Sounds like a good deal, does anyone have this setup or heard anything about this product? Thanks for any information.

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Adrian Eckenrod
MBCA, PCA, BMWCCA & SCCA* member
86 190 2.3-16
83 944 ITS Racer

Hey Adrian,
I will be needing ultra high performance stuff for the 500E so we should compare notes. Right now itt has well worn Michelin XGT's that are totally inadequate. (this car will spin the 225 tires loose even after they are hooked up when the motor gets between torque and HP peaks) What are your experiences with the Bridgestone S02's and the MXX3 Michelin? I have driven those tires on cars briefly but not owned. If you have any longterm knowledge regarding them I would be interested. I would also be interested in the P-Zero Asimetrico but I don't know of any sizes that match up to sizes that would fit on the 500E's stock 16x8 rims. I'm not nuts about the SP9000, everything I have read said it is heavily biased towards touring traits vs more of an all out performer like the SP8000. I've read alot of literature on tires, but I'm always wanting to learn more. Plus, nothing is as telling as personal experience from someone who is very knowledgeable.

I have run Bridgestone RE71's on the 400E as well and was not as impressed with them. They were good in the dry, fair in the wet, and spooky at the limit. Not to mention they wore very quickly. I had 225/50/16 Firestone SZ50's on the 400E and they felt "right" for that car. The SZ50's were impressive on the 400E. Dry traction was great, wet traction was 90% of dry, and they were quite predictable at their limit. They also wore more evenly and rode better than the RE71's. However, I'm sure the 500E would overwhelm either of them at stock (225/55/16) size.

I am also debating tire size. 235/50/16 is a great option for stock rims but only the Yokohama AVS Intermediate and Michelin MXM are made in that size. (that I know of) I have heard rumors that both those tires will be discontinued in that size anyway with the MXM being nixed alltogether. 245/50/16...a common size, matches rolling radius almost perfectly, but will it fit properly inside the fenders? (help! MB DOC or Benzmac!) I really want to stick with stock the stock wheels. Your experiences or recommendations with this situation would be appreciated.

I have never seen the smart tire in person. It seems like a real good idea if you have EMT tires. But the extra mass added seems like it would be a real bitch to balance out. It certainly could provide some valuable info in a real-time manner.

BTW, I was actually at Road Atlanta today and was very impressed with the improvements (massive amounts of $$$) Panoz has put into the place since just a couple months ago. You should have a great time in May! Hope to see you then!

Good talkin to you as always....Lee


[This message has been edited by Lee Scheeler (edited 04-17-99).]

I would have no doubt that those XGT's are less than adaquate tires for the 500. The following is partly from my experience and friends (who race) of mine. I personally have never been impresed with Bridgestone's tires, so I don't even consider them. I have never ran Firestone SZ50's but have heard several good things about them. They are a tire I would like to try. I did like the Michelin MXX3's allot, but thus far I am more impressed with my P-Zeros. However they are only three weeks old so I haven't put them to any true tests yet. Oddly enough I have never ran Dunlop tires, despite all the good things I have heard about there SP8000. I have always been a large Pirelli fan so I usually run P7000 which I have always been impressed with, however the P-Zeros are by far superior, of course they only have a 140 treadware. As for Yokohama AVS, even though I have owned a set, I never ran them. Everyone (who didn't really know about racing but thought they did) always praised them. However I have heard nothing but low to mix reviews from serious racers, saying they were not as good as other tires they have ran. So I sold my set to a Porsche club racer (they seem to love those tires), I believe it is because they can drive them to the track and don't have to change tires. I am really impressed with Hoosier as my race tires, but you need at least -2.5 degrees camber -3 is even better. I am sure you are aware of Tire Racks online survey results, that is a good place to get some ideas. Being the large Pirelli fan I am, I spent allot of time talking to the Pirelli rep at StarFest (more time than my girlfriend wanted me too), I was even able to talk the rep into giving my a non-published tire chart he had worked up for Mercedes. His chart says your 500E with an OD of 25.74 can go with a "Plus 0" (same as OE of 225/55/16) 245/50/16 which is available in P7000, a tire I highly recommend. A "Plus 1" size would be 245/45/17 available in the P7000 and P-Zeros.
The Smart Tire setup is suppose to be very light and they have a counter weight on the strap to balance it out. I think I will give it a try.
I too am impressed with the changes at Road Atlanta, I watched the Grand Prix at Road Atlanta today, good race. I still liked the old track but I do realize it was very dangerous. I just think it is a shame that after all that work to get Formula 1 at Road Atlanta in 2000, it is going to be held at Indy Speedway. I have seen the Indy plans, I just hope it turns out good for the race. By the way what other track does Panoz own? Is it Sebring?

Panoz does own Sebring as well. Hopefully the Mercedes/AMG facotry team will participate in the Petit LeMans this year. Unfortunately, I don't think F1 will ever make it to Road Atlanta. No matter what Panoz does to the track he just doesnt' have the political clout with the F1 crowd.

Thanks for the tire advice. I talked with a Yokohama rep today and overall I am not impressed with their tires. (at least for a 500E) I'm looking for street tires for now. How close do you feel the Pirelli 7000 and the PZero are to one another in overall performance? After talking to several people who owned the S02's I think I'll pass on those as well. Since I'm going to stay on stock wheels my choices will be whatever is made in 245/50/16. You mentioned you considered the SP9000...what made you consider that vs the PZero? Also, what impresses you more about the PZero vs the MXX3's you previously owned? Do you think you need alot of negative camber to take advantage of the PZero or P7000? (or at least vs any other tire) Thanks for the info. Good luck in May at the driving clinic.

Lee

[This message has been edited by Lee Scheeler (edited 04-18-99).]