Hi all,

Emergency... My "beautiful" 85 300D, which had been redone and purged of rust turns out to have a LOT of rust in the floorboards.

The car looks like new. It looks great. I checked it out on the street, drove it, felt around it, everything seemed great. It was even a rainy day, and there was no sign of water except for a tiny drip in the trunk, which my 83 also did once in a while.

So after the noreaster on Monday, I started doing work. Ive fixed the tach and figured out all the info about the drivetrain (which was not explained as such when I bought it, but the PO may not have known it either). I sensed a tiny bit of moisture under the driver's seat, so finally today I took out the rear floor mats. Right under the front drivers seat there was a tiny spot of water. So in the driver's rear floor, I took out the mat, and checked for water - it was dry, but I sensed some softness.

So I took out the other rear floor mat. and I see... daylight.

THere is a lot of softness in the passenger rear floor. So I go and look under there - a lot of rust that was partially painted over on the outside. The PO told me that he had a bodyshop who owed him a favor fix the rust - but obviously they didnt do near all of it.

So I feel gipped. Im kind of stupid for not prodding and studying ever last inch of the underbody, I made some assumptions and it has bit me. I am very tempted to ask the PO to take the car back, even if I eat a thousand dollars. Ive had it less than 7 days.

Now, the car is like new everywhere else... but the reason why I didnt repair my pristine 83 was because I thought I could avoid bodywork that is VERY expensive to do right (Id be paying to get it done). So ideas of how much it would theoretically cost to repair would also be great.

Pics to come...


Thanks for any insight and advice!

JMH

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/JHZR2/MBRust/IMG_0620-01.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/JHZR2/MBRust/IMG_0619-01.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/JHZR2/MBRust/IMG_0627-01.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/JHZR2/MBRust/IMG_0626-01.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/JHZR2/MBRust/IMG_0625-01.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/JHZR2/MBRust/IMG_0624-01.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/JHZR2/MBRust/IMG_0623-01.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/JHZR2/MBRust/IMG_0622-01.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j317/JHZR2/MBRust/IMG_0621-01.jpg

. . . . .
So I feel gipped. Im kind of stupid for not prodding and studying ever last inch of the underbody, I made some assumptions and it has bit me. I am very tempted to ask the PO to take the car back, even if I eat a thousand dollars. Ive had it less than 7 days.
. . . . .

how is this the PO's fault ?
seems clear in the photos
every day is a new lesson

youre right and that is fine. The claims were that ALL rust was fixed, and that everything was professionally done. While that all may have been the case, and I did not look, I have to ask the questions.

I didnt roll around enough on the ground checking before I bought the car. That was my fault. I took the PO's word, and that was my fault.

But now Id like some ideas of what Im looking at for repair. I dont have the know how or tools to do this work - it must be professionally done. So I have to then wonder how much it might cost, if repair is even possible (at least appears so, the rust is really close to one of the subframe bolts), and opinions on how sound the car is.

The spot where the passenger seat hits the floor on the back outboard side is where I can see through the foorboard to the ground.

Im worried about the structural integrity of the floor and the car. That was one of the reasons why I didnt fix my 83. Im worried about how good any repair could be here...

Id love any opinions.


Thanks,

JMH

Its rusty. I have seen worse. Just spend an afternoon with some rust stop paint and slow down the process. In the grand scheme of things even the 07 S550 I drove the other day is deteriorating. How we interact to slow down the process is what makes those old classic cars.

that rust near the rear subframe mount doesn't look like it has penetrated where the bolts go, but I may be wrong. The first thing I would do is buy some Rust Destroyer, my home depot here sells it and it is a coating that kills and stops rust, you can get it in pints, gallons, spray cans. I have used it a lot on my own stuff and customers stuff. That will at least stop the rust till you decide what you want to do. Putting in new floor pans is a pretty involved mainly because you have to remove the interior to avoid a fire from flying sparks. As far as that frame piece, I can't tell from the picture how much the frame has been eaten. But I've seen a lot worse than that, and I've repaired a lot worse than that on other cars.

I can really feel for you right now. But yet it is very obvious in the pictures and I would suspect that it was all pretty evident when you bought it. My own opinion of it just from the last two or three pictures is that it is beyond normal repair. To me, it looks "terminal". In some States it will not even pass inspection. When rust gets close to those suspension mounts in the rear, (Or in the front also), there is just not much one can do with them.
I have somewhat the same problem with this wonderful 85 300 D, and it is a long ways from where yours is in the the critical rust areas, and I consider it terminal also. But yet, I have enjoyed that car so much, now for over two years. But I kept my eyes and ears open for a cheap non runner with an excellent body and I finally got one from Bio Pete in Nashville. And he rescued this one and another car from the very jaws of the crusher. Both cars were owned by elderly ladies in the Nashville area, matter of fact they were sisters. Both cars failed in the past couple of years, one with a transmission problem, that is an 85, and the one I bought the word was that it had a blown head gasket. Mine is an 84.
Now I have the car home and I am working on it. Biggest problem I see is that both half shafts are in terrible condition, the flex joint is very bad and the car has a very sunburned driver's front seat and arm rest. The body is totally perfect! No rust! Rocker panels and floor(floor top and bottom side) are like they were assembled yesterday - totally perfect. So I have to come up with a number of repair parts and parts that were removed while waiting for the crusher. Not much there, but the radiator, A/C compressor, glo plug controller, drivers front window motor and regulator and a few other small parts. And it even has the famous traffic safety "Triangle" mounted in the trunk.
Well, here is my plan. If I can get this beauty to run, I am going to run them both. Wet and rainy, run good old blue Sadie, and if it is nice and sunny, Jim will ride in style in Goldie. If I can't get it too run the way it should, then Sadie has offered to donor up whatever it takes, even up to and including a complete heart and lung transplant. Now that is being generous!
But this does not solve your problem. I would contact the seller in a gentle manner and see what you can work out. You have not had the vehicle long enough to know if the rest of it is as good as it looks. So, maybe he will take it back. I don't think he has too, but it is worth a try. But if you can't do any good there, well, maybe you should look at keeping it for an excellent donor car. There are always cars coming on the market that the owners feel the repair that the dealers want for these old cars is just more then they are worth, they are mostly old people, the cars are old and they loosen their grip on them. And that is the time to get them.

yes it is obvious. The day that I said yes, it was raining and I didnt roll around as much as I ought to have. From the side, it is not apparent, you really have to be crouching under to see the rust.

I am going to try to get the PO to take it back, even if it costs me money to do so. I think it is better than the unknowns that lie ahead.

Thanks,

JMH

I dunno. I have seen Porsche's with entire parts of the floorpan rusted out with huge holes and owners still do the repairs. I guess the question is do you want to do the repairs. Even though W123's were produced on a massive scale its things like this that are killing them off one by one. If you like the car I would have a professional take a look and give you a real estimate. If its as bad as you say the last owner won't want it back and then you will have to be the shady one trying to pass it off to someone else. Then again you might be surprised on the estimate. Rust is sometimes difficult to be objective about.

Definitely take it back. Even if you end up losing some money, it's better to be rid of the car. If you don't, then every time you get in it, you'll remember how you got ripped off on the deal and will never be able to enjoy it, even if you have all the rust repaired.

And the next time around, don't finalize the deal until you have the car inspected by a trusted mechanic! But I probably don't need to tell you that now...

I had a few old VW beetles that had rust like that, or worse. Most of my floor pan was essentially gone, and it was creeping up the sides of the car. I cut out as much of the rust as I could, and had a local welder torch off the accessible spots. I then treated the remaining surface rust by grinding with a wire brush attachment on my drill, and some sort of rust treatment product ("Rust Reformer", I think it was called). I then had a local sheet metal fabrication shop cut and bend some heavy guage sheets to fit the rusted/cut out areas, then had a local welding shop weld the panels on. I then got some thinner guage metal which I attached using a rivet gun and sheet metal screws and silicone caulk inside on the joints. The outside of the bottom of the car, I coated with roofing cement. Worked great. The upper body was repaired with sheet metal patches and bondo.

Okay, now I have to confess, this was like 20 years ago. I was a younger man, with lots of spare time and energy. Not sure I would do all that now, but then again, I live in Texas now, rather than New England, so rust is much less of a problem here.

My point is that it is probably treatable, but you might have to find some crazy hick like me (as a younger man) to attack it. :silly: Professionals may not want to deal with it at all, or may charge a LOT of $$.

I keep seeing folks saying this in various threads, and I just don't get it. At least down here, when you buy a used car, you own it! Period. There is no taking back.

and that certainly could be the case. I understand "buyer beware" and all, but given claims of having all rust previously repaired professionally (and the car looking the part), as much of a mistake as I made, it was misrepresented.

Where you come from, and where I come from, there is the situation that when you buy it, you own it. But that does not mean that something so grossly misrepresented might not be taken back as 'goodwill' given my displeasure. Am I dreaming? Probably... but as wrong as I was to believe what he said with only a cursory lookover in the main places that I had worries in my 83, he was just as wrong to explicitly claim that all rust had been professionally fixed. Had he been correct and honest about that fact, I would not be in that situation.

Yes, buyer beware, I know and understand. I messed up - I get that.

But at this point Id like to try to make the best of a bad situation, where I am facing loosing many thousands of dollars - because as far as Im concerned, though the interior looks 'as new', and the visable exterior looks 'as new' with a top-notch paint job and all, the car has zer value, as the best I could do at this point is salvage and sell parts, which I have neither the time or space to do. Id hope that my fellow forum members would be on my side, as opposed to vouching for 'the other guy', who, right or wrong represented and sold something not as claimed.

Its about cutting my losses and making the best of a bad situation. Obviously getting as much of my mone back as possible would be the holy grail scenario. Beyond that, cost efficient repair, and then getting more than $500 for a good interior and fresh engine. All advice is appreciated.

Thanks,

JMH

I keep seeing folks saying this in various threads, and I just don't get it. At least down here, when you buy a used car, you own it! Period. There is no taking back.

I agree, a deal is a deal. Unfortuantely the car you bought is on borrowed time. Rust is the main killer on these unibody mb's. I never drive my nice ones in the winter salt.

i think you should get some por 15 on that quick.

when I bought my 84,after bringing it home and really going over it ,i found several rusty areas.some were severe,including pretty much what you have there.I was worried that my fiancee' might actually go thru the floor in the seat.After cutting out the cancer I used some moderate gauge metal and cut to fit.then painted entire plate with kano's exrust,followed up with some eastwood rust coat(http://www.eastwoodco.com/jump.jsp?itemType=CATEGORY&itemID=372)
then riveted from bottom up and coated whole patch with rubberized undercoat on the outside.Inside ,I had to reposition the seat belt bolt due to its rusty demise.local welder attached the"nut" to another previously bent and shaped plate.this also was riveted in place with stainless rivets,then again covered whole patch with eastwoods rust preventer sealer.So far,so good.

But at this point Id like to try to make the best of a bad situation, where I am facing loosing many thousands of dollars - because as far as Im concerned, though the interior looks 'as new', and the visable exterior looks 'as new' with a top-notch paint job and all, the car has zer value, as the best I could do at this point is salvage and sell parts, which I have neither the time or space to do. Id hope that my fellow forum members would be on my side, as opposed to vouching for 'the other guy', who, right or wrong represented and sold something not as claimed.



Maybee zero value to you but with the correct repairs this car could last for many more years and provide someone else a great deal of pleasure. While it might be dramatic to talk about how worthless the car is from what I gather you have not really had the car up on a lift to make an accurate estimate of the repairs that the car needs. Why trash a perfectly good car just because you are upset you got ripped off?

imho if the car was represented to have had all the rust repaired you have a strong case for getting all of your money back.

did you cut away the undercoating to reveal the rusty areas? if so before you did that it may have looked pretty great. the undercoating on these benzes is so thick it will endure when the underlying metal is gone.

i had one which had a little blister about the size of half a hens egg on the bottom. when i cut away the undercoating to reveal the metal i found a rusty area the size nearly of my forarm.

i would try to get him to take it back for sure.

a deal is a deal unless the product has been misrepresented by the seller. then a deal is not necessarily a deal.

worth a try. the courts may work for you on this. here, for about thirty five bucks you can file in small claims up to three thousand dollar value. no lawyers are necessary and the rules of operation are a lot more casual than in regular court.

you can file for all the money you have lost in the matter too.

but i would try to get him to take it back for sure.

a repair estimate from a reputable body shop would be fairly easy to get and will be good leverage.

i would begin wtih a phone call and if that does not work would follow it immediately with a certified letter.

good luck.

the worst case is where you have someone who is judgement proof (no money and no attachable assets).

tom w

Why trash a perfectly good car just because you are upset you got ripped off?

Trash isnt necessaril the right word, but if I try to 'unload' the car because I cannot do the repair work, and don't feel comfortable with the situation, how much will someone pay for a good engine, like new top paint and like new engine???

Well, on my 83, which was smashed from behind, but has a still perfect engine and trans (still starts on the first cylinder after sitting for 2.5 years), Ill be able to maybe get $500 for it.

Unfortunately that is the reality of the resale of these vehicles from what Ive seen... Fully functional but not as pretty ones go for $2-3000, as-new versions go for a small premium over that, and moderate rust or more makes them nearly worthless, maybe $500...

Thats a big differential...

UGH... we shall see...

Thanks!

JMH

Trash isnt necessaril the right word, but if I try to 'unload' the car because I cannot do the repair work, and don't feel comfortable with the situation, how much will someone pay for a good engine, like new top paint and like new engine???

Well, on my 83, which was smashed from behind, but has a still perfect engine and trans (still starts on the first cylinder after sitting for 2.5 years), Ill be able to maybe get $500 for it.

Unfortunately that is the reality of the resale of these vehicles from what Ive seen... Fully functional but not as pretty ones go for $2-3000, as-new versions go for a small premium over that, and moderate rust or more makes them nearly worthless, maybe $500...

Thats a big differential...

UGH... we shall see...

Thanks!

JMH

Why can't you just paint the areas with rust stop and sell the car and inform the new owner? Its still a very pretty car and the rust likely won't be an issue for some time to come. You might even consider moving the car down south where rust is not an issue and owners don't really worry as much as you guys up north do.

Or even better paint the areas with rust stop and enjoy the car for as long as you can. Your still better off than if you bought a disposable Japanese car price wise.

imho if the car was represented to have had all the rust repaired you have a strong case for getting all of your money back.

did you cut away the undercoating to reveal the rusty areas? if so before you did that it may have looked pretty great. the undercoating on these benzes is so thick it will endure when the underlying metal is gone.

i had one which had a little blister about the size of half a hens egg on the bottom. when i cut away the undercoating to reveal the metal i found a rusty area the size nearly of my forarm.

i would try to get him to take it back for sure.

a deal is a deal unless the product has been misrepresented by the seller. then a deal is not necessarily a deal.

worth a try. the courts may work for you on this. here, for about thirty five bucks you can file in small claims up to three thousand dollar value. no lawyers are necessary and the rules of operation are a lot more casual than in regular court.

you can file for all the money you have lost in the matter too.

but i would try to get him to take it back for sure.

a repair estimate from a reputable body shop would be fairly easy to get and will be good leverage.

i would begin wtih a phone call and if that does not work would follow it immediately with a certified letter.

good luck.

the worst case is where you have someone who is judgement proof (no money and no attachable assets).

tom w

Good luck. Even if you were to sue them and win (unlikely as even small claims judges have limited patience for people who whine about gray area issues that they should have checked before buying) you would still have to collect the judgement. Most individual personal property is protected under the law and the only route you could go would be lien and garnishment. Not to mention the costs involved with all the paperwork up front that you would unlikely recover.

I think Tom's advice of taking the guy to our local Small Claims Court is really a good route to follow. That is if you find talking to the seller is like peeing into the wind. Our member has not stated how much he spent for the car. And perhaps he does not wish to disclose that information. However, without knowing the dollars involved at this point, I find it rather hard to resolve in my mind as to whether or not I would advise him to repair it.
I want I nice car. I have driven nice cars all my life. I love these old Benzs. But I can't stand a rust bucket. And to fix this Benz and remove it from the list of rust buckets to fine car is not going to happen without spending thousands. And I mean THOUSANDS. It just won't happen. And we have to remember what it is. It's a W123 300 D. It is not a 80's model 280 SE Cabriolet with a 4.5 or an SL or SLC. A year ago I took mine to local body shops to see what it would take to make it presentable. My goodness, it went past $10,000.00 so fast it made me dizzy. And pop rivets, rust ender, POR and Eastwood products all have their place. But a patch job is not what I or the member involved want. We want good slick clean cars. And ask any good body man worth his salt, can it be removed and repaired? And they will all say the same thing. No, it can't be done. Patch it up, get it to look good for a couple of years and it is coming apart again. Once there is salt in those joints and panels, as soon as it gets moisture the process just keeps going. Take it back to the seller and make a believer out of him! If you can't do that, then take it to court. It would be a good one for Judge Judy's Court. I would love to see it there.

youre right and that is fine. The claims were that ALL rust was fixed, and that everything was professionally done. While that all may have been the case, and I did not look, I have to ask the questions.

I didnt roll around enough on the ground checking before I bought the car. That was my fault. I took the PO's word, and that was my fault.

But now Id like some ideas of what Im looking at for repair. I dont have the know how or tools to do this work - it must be professionally done. So I have to then wonder how much it might cost, if repair is even possible (at least appears so, the rust is really close to one of the subframe bolts), and opinions on how sound the car is.

The spot where the passenger seat hits the floor on the back outboard side is where I can see through the foorboard to the ground.

Im worried about the structural integrity of the floor and the car. That was one of the reasons why I didnt fix my 83. Im worried about how good any repair could be here...

Id love any opinions.


Thanks,

JMH

JMH-
That rust is heinous! I would have spotted those spray painted rusty rockers and rear subframe mounts without ever having to kneel. I mean those are some jumbo painted-over rust flakes. Can't believe you didn't see those!!!!!Dude- I feel for ya- but realistically were you smoking crack? Living in Jersey of all places you just believe whatever people tell you? Well believe this- you should divest yourself of that car for it WILL break your bank to fix properly and I don't mean maybe. You want a proper and permanent fix for that, pop rivets don't cut it in my view. Not for structural rust anyway, and as far as I'm concerned you got a lot of it. Count on 10k for proper restorative bodywork(no pop-riveted Home Depot gutter metal, preferably no Bondo either) of you can even find someone who will mess with it. That's some championship blue-ribbon rust. I mean ouch! Rust is like an iceberg- the part you actually see is only the tip of it. There's more, and you can take that to the bank. Even if you THINK you've got it all, you're wrong in every case, and the car will continue to rot. Today's lesson should be don't buy Yankee cars period. People up there are generally less handy and don't care about their vehicles and thusly the cars get neglected. Rich folk in Jersey don't even pump their own fuel. What do you want to bet they don't know where their oil dipstick is either. Not baggin on Jersey but hey. So- you flat out KNOW they are not going to take the time to be concerned about the underbody as out of sight means out of mind. It IS possible to have a car in the northeast that doesn't rust IF you WASH the damn thing and keep an eye out on the chassis! JMH your car looks like it was never washed underneath and that's why it rusted so bad. Incomplete care.
If I were you I would lose the jalopy NOW and just drive one of your other six cars until you find a better example preferably from the SOUTH. Best cars come from Arizona or New Mexico. Otherwise you are in for a protracted car-fixing nightmare ordeal that will drag you and your savings into a great depression. Plus you get to think about all the other issues aside from bodywork that cancerpuppy's got. Even if you say it's otherwise perfect we know better. Even if you fix it 'properly' will it ever drive as solid as before? I think not. That car looks like rotten swiss cheese under there.
Good luck and never buy a w123 again unless you check it out thoroughly beforehand.
If you really want to fix why not cannibalize your other w123 for sheet metal. If you did all the zizz-wheel and sawzall work yourself you might save some coin. Huge pain in the neck however.

The thing with the undercoating MB used its it hides most of the rust, its like an iceberg really. You only see a small part poking up. If you got that car up on a lift and started peeling it back you would probably find a lot.

First I'd see if the guy you bought it from would take it back, even if you have to take a little hit. Never hurts to ask.

The most important thing for me when looking at a car I plan on owning a long time, and its essential for a car I want to restore is no rust. Spend $1k and have a W123 shipped to you from CA, or another dry state.


Start with good bones, because a rusty car will always be that no matter what you do to it.

My next keeper MB will be from a very dry state, probably southern CA.

I think Tom's advice of taking the guy to our local Small Claims Court is really a good route to follow. That is if you find talking to the seller is like peeing into the wind. Our member has not stated how much he spent for the car. And perhaps he does not wish to disclose that information. However, without knowing the dollars involved at this point, I find it rather hard to resolve in my mind as to whether or not I would advise him to repair it.


Not really a good idea. Its likely you would loose since there are no laws about the private sale of used vehicles and commonly known that you should inspect a car before buying it. Filing a case and loosing just means more money down the drain. Take that money and fix the car and stop whining about a potentially small problem on what sounds like a really beautiful car.

Its really a shame that everyone here claims to love MB cars right up until a big repair bill comes in and then everyone runs to trade in or ditch the cars. If you love your cars so much then FIX THEM. If your too cheap to fix your car then you should not have a three pointed star on your hood. Go get a Lexus and be done with it.

If you can get a refund from the guy of $1,000 or so, I would fix it. This site (www.dbdepot.de) can ship you the parts for the entire floor and depending how much you need the work may not be that expensive. The rockers are available for under $300 or so. If you can handle removing the mechanical stuff and the interior, you might be pleasantly surprised. And there really is nothing better than knowing you have a truly rust free structure. Jim

If you can get a refund from the guy of $1,000 or so, I would fix it. This site (www.dbdepot.de) can ship you the parts for the entire floor and depending how much you need the work may not be that expensive. The rockers are available for under $300 or so. If you can handle removing the mechanical stuff and the interior, you might be pleasantly surprised. And there really is nothing better than knowing you have a truly rust free structure. Jim

Dunno if your going to be able to collect from the seller but thats a great idea. Just to put this into perspective for you guys. The 722.6 Transmission in my 140 is about a $4500 job for a rebuild. Makes fixing rust seem cheap in comparison. :)

[quote=rchase;1485913]Not really a good idea. Its likely you would loose since there are no laws about the private sale of used vehicles and commonly known that you should inspect a car before buying it. Filing a case and loosing just means more money down the drain. Take that money and fix the car and stop whining about a potentially small problem on what sounds like a really beautiful car.

Its really a shame that everyone here claims to love MB cars right up until a big repair bill comes in and then everyone runs to trade in or ditch the cars. If you love your cars so much then FIX THEM. If your too cheap to fix your car then you should not have a three pointed star on your hood. Go get a Lexus and be done with it.[/quote

That kind of rust is not a small problem. Were talking about a 300D, not some rare car that should be saved. The reason most of us like these cars is because they are cheap to buy and cheap to maintain. I dont work on my car because I like to, I do it because I dont want to pay someone else to do it, and if I am doing the work I want the car to be simple. That is why these cars appeal to so many, Cheap and Simple!
And another thing, cars are inanimate objects. They dont have feelings and they dont love you back!

If you havent guessed, I dont name my cars!

I went through this with my son on his (formerly my) 1986 190E 2.3-16. He replaced all four fenders and the underbody (floors and rockers). He did some of the preparations and reassembly, but the underbody parts were not the heavy cost. No real finishing required - just paint with POR 15 and then undercoating and painting the inside - so it is not the time consuming and costly part of the job. Even the body parts were relatively less costly than the more visible fenders. The most expensive stuff, by the way, were the plastic spoiler parts.

Once you get going on one of these jobs though you will find yourself changing brake lines, and doing some rewiring. All good stuff and stuff you can do yourself.

This all assumes the stuff that looks good is good. I would caution you to check that out carefully especially around the wheel wells.

But a car with no rust from MB's W123 line is something special. Jim

That kind of rust is not a small problem. Were talking about a 300D, not some rare car that should be saved. The reason most of us like these cars is because they are cheap to buy and cheap to maintain. I dont work on my car because I like to, I do it because I dont want to pay someone else to do it, and if I am doing the work I want the car to be simple. That is why these cars appeal to so many, Cheap and Simple!
And another thing, cars are inanimate objects. They dont have feelings and they dont love you back!

If you havent guessed, I dont name my cars!

Yes your right 300D's are quite common but with the biodiesel craze and owners that have a disposable cheap attitude like you do they will become less and less common. You can't have your cake and eat it too. Your going to have to do "something". Trashing a car that runs well and looks presentable and is a good driver over rust (which you have not even looked at the extent of) is really silly. While you might have alluded to the fact that I talk to my cars (which I do!) your solution to your problem is just as emotional because you feel ripped off. Why take it out on the car? If your truly interested in your financial stake in the car why not run the numbers and accurately determine your best position rather than being dramatic and emotional?

Its really a shame that decent cars end up in the hands of not very decent owners. If you want a soul less cheap to maintain reliable car go buy a Honda. Many Mercedes owners out there truly love their cars. Any older MB represents the years of service visits and repairs that an owner has sunk into a car well above its financial value. One of the reasons why no one looks bad in an older Mercedes is because of the care that many Mercedes owners lavish on their cars regardless of their age. Face it nobody likes a cheapskate. :)

rchase, I agree with you. I spared no expense on my like new 83 300D, and had a top notc experience. It is the character and economy of operation, noit cheap purchase and cheap repairs that make these cars to my liking.

I do not mind sinking good money into my cars, and will do so as necessary. I fel gipped and made a stupid mistake here, but the rest of the car looks so darn good, that it is a shame that thsi issue is ruining it.

Im actively looking into the correct structural repair...

JimSmith's son did it, Ill see what I can do.

Jim - the wheel wells are very solid. Other than the one picture I posted, there is nothing else wrong with them, even the inner edge of the outer sdheetmetal, where they tend to rust. I prodded them all the other day when I first found this rust, and they were solid. Today being a very nice day, I checked them even more - pressed harder, tapped, prodded with a screwdriver, etc. They are indeed very solid, excpet that one spot!

Thanks,

JMH

YYou can't have your cake and eat it too. Your going to have to do "something". Trashing a car that runs well and looks presentable and is a good driver over rust (which you have not even looked at the extent of) is really silly.

It is a great runner and great driver. Very smooth and everythiung inside and above the rust is like new. Any other blue like new parts I can take from my 83 that is ruined.

When I say that it isw worthless - if I let anyone know of this rust, they would potentially be scared to buy it. I view its as such, and thus my donedness previously. After additional proddint today, I can tell that the subframe mounting screws are in solid metal, and that things arent terribly horrible, though they do look quite poor (lol, that doest make much sense, does it?).

Fixing I wil likely do. Request some cash back? Ill try for that too, this will cost me $$$.

I wonder if I can weld in a whole new half-floorboard...

JMH

I see a lot of threads on here about rust. My 79 240d has a decent amount of rust, and although I don't like it, its not the end of the world. Those same rear mounts are rusty on my car, my rockers are all rusted up, rust on the floorboards, in the back, on the wheel well...man, now I'm depressed. Anyway, I am going to treat what I can with POR or some similar product, patch, and paint. It won't look like new, but hopefully will look decent. When your car is nearing 30 years old, and used daily, rust is going to happen. It would be nice to see a sticky or something covering "definitive rust repair" or similar. There are probably a lot of people like me with some rust, but no welder or enough money to have a body shop professionally deal with it.

Actually, rust is not just "going to happen". If you hate rust, move to Texas!

Yes your right 300D's are quite common but with the biodiesel craze and owners that have a disposable cheap attitude like you do they will become less and less common. You can't have your cake and eat it too. Your going to have to do "something". Trashing a car that runs well and looks presentable and is a good driver over rust (which you have not even looked at the extent of) is really silly. While you might have alluded to the fact that I talk to my cars (which I do!) your solution to your problem is just as emotional because you feel ripped off. Why take it out on the car? If your truly interested in your financial stake in the car why not run the numbers and accurately determine your best position rather than being dramatic and emotional?

Its really a shame that decent cars end up in the hands of not very decent owners. If you want a soul less cheap to maintain reliable car go buy a Honda. Many Mercedes owners out there truly love their cars. Any older MB represents the years of service visits and repairs that an owner has sunk into a car well above its financial value. One of the reasons why no one looks bad in an older Mercedes is because of the care that many Mercedes owners lavish on their cars regardless of their age. Face it nobody likes a cheapskate. :)

Refering to someone as a "cheapskate" because they dont want to spend thousands on a $1500 car is irresponsable. Put your money where your mouth is. I'm sure that JMH would gladly accept what he paid for the car and then you can save it. While your at it I've got a couple of 300D's sitting at the farm that I have been using as donor cars (so that others might live). They are pretty well stripped down to the chassis, but they are still fixable. To show my compassion for this just cause, I'll make you a hell of a deal.

Here's a quick estimate for you. 20-30 hours of labor. Removing the seats, carpeting and disconnecting all the wires and vacuum lines leading to the trunk. Tarping the dash and roof liner areas. Tarping or masking the doors. Cutting out ALL the rusted areas back to "clean" metal. Body floor pans from a donor (more labor involved going this route) or new. 14 gauge sheet metal formed to replace the side supports. Weld in the new/old floor pans and side supports. Grind and seal the seams. Coat the floor pans with rustproofing. Reinstall the carpeting and seats.

30 hours shop labor at about $65 an hour = $1950.00 plus about $300 for new pans and sheet metal (used can be anywhere from free to about $100.00), $100 or so for incidentals.

If you do the "grunt" labor and have a welding shop weld in the pans (strongly recommended) you can get it in good shape for about $500.00.

I wouldn't recommend using formed sheet metal to replace the pans in your case because your subframe mount area has rusted away.

Your call. I personally don't think the car is worth it but what do I know? I just did this on a '72 250C which was worse than yours. Why? Because my wife loves her car and I like to sleep at night.

Actually, rust is not just "going to happen". If you hate rust, move to Texas!

Or just store the car in a heated garage all winter.:D

They only rust if you drive them in the salt, avoid the salt, keep it clean and the body will last forever.