It's mounted but not running yet. Hopefully I will have some information on how it drives tomorrow. I still have to hook up the oil return, vacuum actuator and re-install my intercooler. Stay tuned...

http://superturbodiesel.com/std/download/file.php?id=169

It's mounted but not running yet. Hopefully I will have some information on how it drives tomorrow. I still have to hook up the oil return, vacuum actuator and re-install my intercooler. Stay tuned...


very cool, and very interested in how this works out for you.

blaze the trail, lewis- clark is ahead of you somewhere....
The masses await your word. :D

How do you plan on controlling it?

Are you measuring exhaust pressure with that copper line?

Here is how the control will work:
The turbo vanes are normally closed for fast spool times. As boost pressure increases a pressure actuator opens the vanes to limit boost (this is how forcedinduction's VNT works), the pressure actuator should limit boost at about 15 psi.

At wide open throttle the Vacuum Control Valve is putting out no vacuum so the turbo will be controlled by the pressure actuator alone. At lower throttle the vacuum from the VCV will open the vanes to further reduce boost via a vacuum actuator mounted opposite of the pressure actuator. This should solve the problem of the turbo putting out full boost no matter what position the throttle is at, which exists when a pressure actuator alone is used.

The vacuum control valve puts out a maximum of 15" or so of vacuum which is around -7.8 psi. My pressure and vacuum actuators are roughly the same diameter so every psi of vacuum applied to the vacuum actuator will be equivalent to a psi applied to the pressure actuator, and should reduce the boost the turbo is producing by the same amount. At low throttle my boost level will theoretically be 15 psi – 7.8 psi = 7.2 psi. The factor of boost reduction from the vacuum signal could be adjusted by increasing the size of the vacuum actuator. I also plan to use a vacuum thumbwheel from a euro headlight setup to reduce or cut off the vacuum signal to the turbo on the fly.

Yes, the copper tube is for measuring the pressure at the turbine inlet.

Hopefully I can finish it tonight.

It's up and running. My first test around the block had the turbo making 15 psi of boost on light to moderate acceleration. This run was with the helper spring disconnected. When cruising the boost was around 10 psi or so, but there was instant boost when I stomped on it. (vertical is 15 psi on the boost gauge)
Video

I hooked up the helper spring and now cruise is 7-8 psi with similar boost on acceleration. The boost pressure can spike to 25 psi or more on a quick takeoff which produces 50 PSI in the exhaust manifold, and noticable bogging of the engine. I still have a bit of work to do...

Here is a rev at idle Video

Sounds MEAN!



Water-Air IC? nice setup.



Could you provide more pictures of the actuator setup and possible a little photoshop schematic of it all?

Here is one more picture of the installed turbo/IC
http://superturbodiesel.com/std/download/file.php?id=170

I mounted a wastegate actuator on the bracket that the vacuum actuator that came with the turbo was mounted on, then made a new bracket to mount the vacuum actuator opposite of the pressure actuator.
http://superturbodiesel.com/std/download/file.php?id=113

http://superturbodiesel.com/std/download/file.php?id=114

The vanes are fully closed (high boost position) with no vacuum or pressure signals, and open with pressure or vacuum. The linkage arms both fit onto the vane control lever.
http://superturbodiesel.com/std/download/file.php?id=117
My pressure actuator took a bit more pressure than I liked to begin opening, so I added a helper spring to lower the opening pressure.

http://superturbodiesel.com/std/download/file.php?id=145

I can draw up a diagram of the lines, but it is quite simple. The vacuum signal line for the transmission is tapped for the signal to the vacuum actuator, the pressure actuator is hooked up like a standard wastegate, with a signal line tapped into the compressor outlet.


I need to try driving it with the vanes fully open to see if I still get 20+ psi of boost at high RPMs. If I do then that means that the turbine is too small to work ideally on the 617 and I will need to add an external wastegate, if the boost level is OK with them fully open then I need to find a better pressure actuator.

Dont just look at it as PSI, the main thing you want to look at is CFM.


Max psi is one thing, boost threshold is another....

I'm not sure I follow.

If the vanes are fully open, and I am still building 50 PSI of exhaust pressure in front of the turbo then the turbine is too small to flow the volume of exhaust that it needs to in this engine, and I will need to add a wastegate to bypass the turbine when the boost is still rising but the vanes are fully open.

The Liberty CRD is a 2.8L engine that redlines at 4,300RPM vs the 617 at 3.0L and a what, 5,000RPM redline? The Liberty also uses 20+ psi of boost, where as I only want 15 max.

I have still yet to test drive the car with the vane actuators disabled and the vanes fully open. I am hopeful that boost will stay under 15-20 PSI at full load and high RPMs.

Are you sure your actuators are moving the full stroke? Your vacuum actuator looks to be pretty short...

The vane lever travels about a good 3/4".

no, I'm not sure, but I will check. The vacuum actuator should have enough travel though, it came with the turbo. :D

I just got back from a test drive with the vanes fully open and could not get the boost to hit more than 13 psi with the turbine inlet pressure never reaching 25-27 psi. It appears that the turbo is a fine size for the 617 and that my problem with over-boosting/high turbine inlet pressure is caused by my pressure actuator. I am talking with forge motorsport about having a custom pressure actuator made for me, as I have not been able to find a large diameter pressure actuator that operates at the pressures I need. http://www.forgemotorsport.co.uk/content.asp?inc=product&cat=0001&product=FMAC48CUST

I did a few 0-60 runs and noticed that my EGTs are abot 250* F lower than with the stock T3 (650 vs 850). Looks like it's time to bump up the fuel. :D

I just got back from a test drive with the vanes fully open and could not get the boost to hit more than 13 psi with the turbine inlet pressure never reaching 25-27 psi. It appears that the turbo is a fine size for the 617 and that my problem with over-boosting/high turbine inlet pressure is caused by my pressure actuator. I am talking with forge motorsport about having a custom pressure actuator made for me, as I have not been able to find a large diameter pressure actuator that operates at the pressures I need. http://www.forgemotorsport.co.uk/content.asp?inc=product&cat=0001&product=FMAC48CUST

I did a few 0-60 runs and noticed that my EGTs are abot 250* F lower than with the stock T3 (650 vs 850). Looks like it's time to bump up the fuel. :D

Ask them if they can make more than one... I have a turbo in a box in the garage waited to be liberated.:D

I did a few 0-60 runs and noticed that my EGTs are abot 250* F lower than with the stock T3 (650 vs 850). Looks like it's time to bump up the fuel. :D


I think you have a gauge problem, 650*f is about what it should be running at just cruising on the highway at a steady speed.

Those temperatures are closer to what one would see post-turbo.

Cruise is abut 450-500 for me.

Update:

With the 10 psi pressure actuator the turbo’s operation was far from ideal. I had to adjust the pressure actuator’s rod as far out (long) as I can get it which made the vanes start about half-way open. This allowed me to not hit crazy boost pressure but I was not getting the full benefit of the VNT. I also still had some high exhaust pressures when rapidly accelerating in 1st and 2nd as the actuator tried to open the vanes. This excess exhaust pressure caused a noticeable loss of power.

My 5 psi (I think) actuator arrived today and it works INFINITELY better!!!! Cruise is now 3-4 psi and it hits 11 psi on acceleration almost as fast as I can press the go pedal. Best of all no more exhaust pressure spike!!! The highest exhaust pressure I hit now is 25 psi vs. 50 or so that I was hitting before.

I have enough power to do a burn out now and even get sideways when I punch it in second around a corner :D (it was wet out :rolleyes:).

The GT2056V Shaved 1 sec off of my 0-60 time, but the car definitely "feels" faster with the faster boost response. :D

why wouldn't one of these (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/New-Dual-port-Wastegate-Actuator-Turbo-Garrett_W0QQitemZ380033759599QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item380033759599&) work?

The actuator's diaphragm surface area is too small and the second port is not sealed.

THIS (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Garrett-Adjustable-Wastegate-Actuator-REMANUFACTURED_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33742QQihZ004QQitemZ140239903422QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW)*l ooks* like the actuator I used, but you should confirm the pressure rating if you intend to use it for VNT control. 5 psi or so is what you need. A good rule of thumb is if you can grasp the head in one hand and the shaft in the other and move it by hand it should work. I could not nearly get my 10 psi actuator to move, but the 5 psi was able to be moved by hand.

Yeah, I was looking at that one.

I had to cut some more threads in the rod and shorten the rod to use it with the stock GT2056V bracket and turn buckle.

BG, what size thread was the oil supply on yours? I have tried 10mmx1.0 and 10mmx1.5 neither works. A 1/8" NPT seems to thread in better than the 10X1.0. Maybe it's 3/8"?

I swear that it was M10x1.0. I'm looking for the receipt for the hose I had made, I'll let you know if I find it.

There must have been some crud in the threads. I forced a M10x1.0 in a few threads and then it went fine. This was after I threaded in a 1/8 NPT :0