Hello all,
Just thought I would drop a line as to who I am. I have two 190 2.3-16 and I am heavily into modifing them to perform better. I race in SCCA, but I am trading my SCCA 16V for a Porsche 944 ITS racer. I am keeping the second 16V as a driving school and "fun" car (it just doesn't class well in SCCA). I have P-Zero 225/45/16 street tires and 15" Hoosier track tires. Right now the engine is basically stock but I have been doing MANY other things to the car, to prepare it for a better engine. That is one thing everyone must be concerned with, if you want 220hp+ then you better make sure the rest of the car can handle it(brakes, suspension, etc). When that time comes my car is off to Canada for AMG to custom build the engine (still saving $$$ for that day). I love working on the car and have a ton of experience working on about ever aspect of the 16V and performance for it. If anyone has any 16V questions feel free to ask me, as well I always welcome any others ideas and like to hear what others have done to their 16V's. Happy racing.

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Adrian Eckenrod
MBCA, PCA, BMWCCA & SCCA* member
86 190 2.3-16
87 190 2.3-16
*

I wish SCCA would allow cars with 16V engines to compete in CLUB racing. The competition board says that this engine is able to create too much HP for "E" production. I guess you run CSP in your 16V (solo2).

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MERCEDES BENZ MASTER GUILD TECHNICIAN
ASE MASTER TECHNICIAN
27 YEARS M.B. TECH

Hello Adrian,

I was looking through the old topics and noticed you were talking about amg tuners in Canada. I have called Renntech in the past about what modifications that they could do for a 16v. Going to amg group appeals to me. I am courious about how are they are going to rebuild you engine. What kind of performance gains are they claiming and does include 2.5 conversion like renntech offers.
Renntech claims 235hp with 2.5 conversion. If you could please let me know what you what amg offers for the 16v mainly the engine, and what kind of price they quoted.
Also who would a good contact person that you know of and phone number at amg.

Well this year I am working on new exauhst system. I know tired out topic I you could I would like some input on this. I plan to run a 2.5 exaust system. The factory one is faling apart, literally. Well this what I plan to use.... random technology cat. and borla XR-1 racing muffler(universal)and do away with the pre-cats.The borla muffler I am going to use is supposed to be the quitest XR-1. I know it is going to be louder. If is to loud, I will run a second XR-1 muffler where the resonator is located. I know you suggest running the exahst with out the main cat, I consider it figured its more trouble than it worth I am required to do emmission testing when you live in the inner city area. I would appreciate any comments on this. because I plan to have the work done in Dec. 99.


Thank you
Mauro Gutierrez
87 190e 16v

Hi i was looking at buying a c280 but now thinking about buying a 190e 16v 2.3L car as should be quicker and more fun i think to drive, was wondering how much maintance and cost is involved in running these cars as i would like to use it as a daily driver, also how strong are the manual gearbox's and diff's
any thing to look for on the car before buyng, how much are parts
cheers

There's really no "strength" issues with the Getrag 5 speed or the limited slip differential worth noting. The 2.3-16's unfortunately, approaching 20 years, suffer from a few quirks. Used examples typically suffer from abuse and lack of maintenance, especially if the current owner isn't the original or near original owner, since maintenance can get pricey on these cars and subsequent owners tend to be less diligent.

The twincam engine uses shims to adust valve clearances instead of hydraulic lifters, so those need to be serviced. The hydraulic rear suspension can be costly to repair if it needs service, along with keeping the rest of the rear multi-link suspension parts in good order.

As a daily driver, once you get used to the dog-legged first gear position, the only thing you may notice is that the powerband doesn't really come on till the revs get up a bit higher than most other Mercedes 4 cylinders. The car is really a joy on long twisty drives where it can stretch out.

Do you know where I could find a new factory oil temp, stop watch, and volt meter for a 1986 190 16v?
Thanks
Kevin (Fred's son)

New? I think the LCD timer alone was over $200 at the dealer. The other gauges are VDO standard. Instead of the timer, I've seen people replace it with tiimers for planes/boats, quartz clocks, or other accessory gauges.

Hi,
I've got a 1983 Mercedes 300d (diesel sedan, 5cyl natural engine.) It also has a Getrag 5speed manual (It was a Euro-market car). The transmission has an odd clanking sound at idle and low speed with the clutch engaged. I'm told that some Porsche 924 or 944 models had a Getrag 5 speed that was subject to a recall because of a clanking noise. Do you know anything about this, whether this might be the same problem?
Any comments would be appreciated.
SEO

The gearboxes tend to clatter a bit at idle with the clutch out and that is normal.

Tom W

The SCCA has many 16 valve car classes, the 190 16V is classed in ITS at 2800 Lbs. I have raced against one, its a dog on the track.

lol.....you guys realize that you just revived a thread from 1999 right? hahah. you are all freaking idiots

Just because it's old doesn't make it less important.

But damn, what an oldie lol.

I know.....it just made me laugh. Anyway, carry on :D

The SCCA has many 16 valve car classes, the 190 16V is classed in ITS at 2800 Lbs. I have raced against one, its a dog on the track.

Hmmm,perhaps the car you raced was maybe not well prepared or not being driven to it's full potential.

I managed to set a lap record at Heartland Park Topeka, and win two championships in a single season,,,with a 16v. I also had a lot of fun by consistantly finishing ahead of most of the "american sedan" guys.

One big advantage to the 16v was that I never had a single mechanical "DNF" in seven years of racing it. (and some years I managed to run 12-14 weekends,,,plus test days)

I also believe the ITS track record at road Atlanta for many years was set by Mike Flynn in a 16v.


A properly prepped 16v can make a really fun car,,,,the drawbacks are lack of "off the shelf" performance upgrades,,,, and lack of popularity,,,,
so it's atough learning curve for some.
It's just easier for most to run a "me too" car, like a miata or RX7, since there are so many of them around.

The reason the 16v has to weigh so much is because the SCCA is well aware of the performance potential of the car.
If they weren't "scared" of it kicking everyones tail,,,they would allow it to weight much less.
Just look at the 3 series BMWs. They practically own ITS eventhough they have had to continuously add weight.

An old thread,,,yes,,,,but don't rule out the 16v as a good track car. With the right prep, they are competitive.

Hey wuzz-up? Where can I find sway bars for this car?

Most people just use 500e, 300e lime or 300ce sport line sway bars on their 190e's. That are all the same between those three I think. I think the ultimate stiffness upgrade is the use of BMW e36 coil overs on the w201's.

If somebody can explain me what is better from a coil over vs the normal setup please do.
Only thing i can think of that you can adjust the ride height.
But you also can do that with springs, just ad rubbers on top of the spring or cut the spring down.
Also it is a huge work to fit coil overs because you need to weld new mounting points on the car and cut away some stuff.
This is the setup i have bought from Thorsten.
It is a setup made for racing on the nordschleife
Not stiff enough?
http://i529.photobucket.com/albums/dd334/dennisbots/Bilstein_-1.jpg
http://i529.photobucket.com/albums/dd334/dennisbots/Bilstein1.jpg

Also H&R make's custom setups that can be adjusted to the nordschleife.
And don't forget to trow out your rubber bushings and replace them with delrin/Prothane etc. (al of them)

Btw sinds this tread is about 16V performance, this is my new exhaust header:
Original from the DTM so it was no bargain haha
http://i529.photobucket.com/albums/dd334/dennisbots/Bilstein2.jpg
http://i529.photobucket.com/albums/dd334/dennisbots/Bilstein4.jpg
http://i529.photobucket.com/albums/dd334/dennisbots/Bilstein3.jpg

Wow...those are some Springs!!! Beautiful header as well...!

Have you thought about having that header re-produced? I'm sure it leans Heavily towards top end power but sure would be fun:)

Jonathan

coil over allow ride height adjustment, the ability to carner balance the car,and the offer less unsprung weight due to the smaller lighter spring. also the wheel rate is usually more with the same or lighter coil over spring due to the lever ratio of the spring placement, plus the suspension usually will bind less because the spring is on the damper, instead of between the control arm and the frame where some of the rate is lost trying to deflect the control arm from its desired range of motion. 1 more plus, coil over springs are cheap and made in many rates and lenghts allowing fine tuning of the suspension for the desired application, do you need all this....that depends on the usage, but generally coil overs will handle and ride better than a conventional arrangement with a similar set up.

Wait, E36 coilovers on a 201?



201 and 124s are largely the same suspension... Tell me more about this... I would like to make the swap!!!

Wait, E36 coilovers on a 201?



201 and 124s are largely the same suspension... Tell me more about this... I would like to make the swap!!!

Some dude on 190 revolution was talking about it and some guy posted pics of the swap completed. I will be doing this swap in the coming months to a 2.6 manual 190e. The key is that the 190 has shock towers, making camber plates possible and easy to install and installing the lower part is just a matter of drilling and measurement.

Some dude on 190 revolution was talking about it and some guy posted pics of the swap completed. I will be doing this swap in the coming months to a 2.6 manual 190e. The key is that the 190 has shock towers, making camber plates possible and easy to install and installing the lower part is just a matter of drilling and measurement.

Link?

PM ffa spector on the 190revolution.net forums.